Comments on: Cap and Trade: Challenge your Senators to read the bill http://mindyourowndamnbusinesspolitics.com/wordpress/2009/06/27/cap-and-trade-challenge-your-senators-to-read-the-bill/ A movement toward critical thinking in politics Wed, 17 Mar 2010 04:09:17 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=abc hourly 1 By: Cap and Trade: Challenge Your Senators To Read the Bill | Mind … http://mindyourowndamnbusinesspolitics.com/wordpress/2009/06/27/cap-and-trade-challenge-your-senators-to-read-the-bill/comment-page-1/#comment-2876 Cap and Trade: Challenge Your Senators To Read the Bill | Mind … Mon, 14 Sep 2009 14:19:11 +0000 http://mindyourowndamnbusinesspolitics.com/wordpress/?p=862#comment-2876 [...] We the People need to demand that the members of the U.S. Senate , in a bipartisan action, request a thorough analysis of costs and benefits from the CBO. Then, Senators and their staffs need to carefully read the CBO analysis and the …Next Page [...] [...] We the People need to demand that the members of the U.S. Senate , in a bipartisan action, request a thorough analysis of costs and benefits from the CBO. Then, Senators and their staffs need to carefully read the CBO analysis and the …Next Page [...]

]]> By: Les Horn http://mindyourowndamnbusinesspolitics.com/wordpress/2009/06/27/cap-and-trade-challenge-your-senators-to-read-the-bill/comment-page-1/#comment-650 Les Horn Wed, 01 Jul 2009 22:03:41 +0000 http://mindyourowndamnbusinesspolitics.com/wordpress/?p=862#comment-650 CAP and TRADE(TAX) is ENRON forced onto everyone. CAP and TRADE(TAX) is the most damaging plan for American Freedom. CAP and TRADE(TAX) places the entire U.S. economy on the shoulders of speculation and manipulation within the Chicago Clinmate Exchange(CCX) CAP and TRADE(TAX) slaughters middle class America and small business. The wealther will get richer (CCX) and the poor will get free government grants to pay their bills and buy their votes, while the U.S. government creates this hugh slush fund for more world government expansion and manipulation. Don't just say no to CAP and TRADe(TAX)! Just say hell no to CAP and TRADE(TAX) ENRON type trading scheme that would change American freedom in a very bad European Union way. A legal American citizen from Atlanta, GA HAPPY 4th all year long. CAP and TRADE(TAX) is ENRON forced onto everyone.
CAP and TRADE(TAX) is the most damaging plan for American Freedom.
CAP and TRADE(TAX) places the entire U.S. economy on the shoulders of speculation and manipulation within the Chicago Clinmate Exchange(CCX)
CAP and TRADE(TAX) slaughters middle class America and small business.
The wealther will get richer (CCX) and the poor will get free government grants to pay their bills and buy their votes, while
the U.S. government creates this hugh slush fund for more world
government expansion and manipulation.
Don’t just say no to CAP and TRADe(TAX)!
Just say hell no to CAP and TRADE(TAX) ENRON type trading scheme that would change American freedom in a very bad European Union way.
A legal American citizen from Atlanta, GA
HAPPY 4th all year long.

]]> By: Cap and Trade: Air is not supposed to be orange | Mind Your Own Damn Business Politics http://mindyourowndamnbusinesspolitics.com/wordpress/2009/06/27/cap-and-trade-challenge-your-senators-to-read-the-bill/comment-page-1/#comment-641 Cap and Trade: Air is not supposed to be orange | Mind Your Own Damn Business Politics Wed, 01 Jul 2009 11:05:35 +0000 http://mindyourowndamnbusinesspolitics.com/wordpress/?p=862#comment-641 [...] Congress passed an environmental bill. The Cap and Trade bill was a 1,200 page mess that no one had read. The facts around the costs and impacts of the bill were in dispute because a study by the [...] [...] Congress passed an environmental bill. The Cap and Trade bill was a 1,200 page mess that no one had read. The facts around the costs and impacts of the bill were in dispute because a study by the [...]

]]> By: Brett http://mindyourowndamnbusinesspolitics.com/wordpress/2009/06/27/cap-and-trade-challenge-your-senators-to-read-the-bill/comment-page-1/#comment-596 Brett Sat, 27 Jun 2009 19:19:04 +0000 http://mindyourowndamnbusinesspolitics.com/wordpress/?p=862#comment-596 Well....what did you expect from a bunch of criminals. It's too bad we can't throw the RICO act at the entire bunch....conspiracy to commit fraud, larcency, etc. Just like in the "stimulus" bill, there's going to be wording in there that will protect certain elements and friends of the administration ("it's OK...I lied about no lobbyists with my presidency...BHO"). I'm sure the oversight provisions in it are weak, and fraud and waste are bound to follow. It's breathtaking how fast BHO wants to do things....it's as if he knows his time is short before 2010 (assuming the GOP can get their sh-t together). Well….what did you expect from a bunch of criminals. It’s too bad we can’t throw the RICO act at the entire bunch….conspiracy to commit fraud, larcency, etc.

Just like in the “stimulus” bill, there’s going to be wording in there that will protect certain elements and friends of the administration (“it’s OK…I lied about no lobbyists with my presidency…BHO”). I’m sure the oversight provisions in it are weak, and fraud and waste are bound to follow.

It’s breathtaking how fast BHO wants to do things….it’s as if he knows his time is short before 2010 (assuming the GOP can get their sh-t together).

]]> By: Ceolas http://mindyourowndamnbusinesspolitics.com/wordpress/2009/06/27/cap-and-trade-challenge-your-senators-to-read-the-bill/comment-page-1/#comment-594 Ceolas Sat, 27 Jun 2009 19:03:15 +0000 http://mindyourowndamnbusinesspolitics.com/wordpress/?p=862#comment-594 Hey Robert, Good blog name "Mind Your Own Damn Business Politics" - wish the house would actually mind the business of CO2, assuming it needs to be dealt with anyway. You talk about the costs... Well one thing that keeps getting ignored is the ENERGY EFFICIENCY side of savings: Maybe it sounds too good to criticize. BAN consumers from buying what they WANT and applaud the savings! (Little savings in banning impopular products, and inefficient products need to be popular or noone would buy them, classic example Edison’s light bulb, bought 19 times out of 20 in the USA and therefore a banning priority with a big section 211 all to its own in the Waxman-Markey Bill!). The fact is that efficiency regulation on a product sacrifices performance, construction, appearance and price features, and does not necessarily give the savings suggested anyway. See http://ceolas.net/#cc2x onwards regarding efficiency regulation effect on buildings, lightbulbs, cars, dishwashers and other products. As for Cap and Trade….. Cap and Trade is an expensive roundabout way of achieving…not very much. Whatever one’s attitude to greenhouse gas emissions, they be lowered just by changes in electricity and transport (together responsible for 4/5 of emissions!). Electricity and transport changes have their own advantages - regardless of also lowering CO2: 1. Local environmental benefit from less pollution of sulphur and all else that's in the emissions, regardless of the less certain or immediate global benefit from CO2 reduction - and that is one reason why the focus on carbon trading is wrong, compared with the focus on reducing fuel combustion emissions. 2. Electricity supply alternatives which together with improved grid distribution gives better conmpetition and keeps down electricity bills for consumers. 3. Transport alternatives (using electricity, hydrogen and other energy sources), which also reduces the dependency on oil imports. In 2020, from then available evidence, either 1. There is increasing consensus that global warming can’t be stopped anyway, and that further specific reduction attempts have no value: In that case little has been lost, since the described changes in electricity and transport industry carry their own benefit, or 2. Consensus remains that CO2 emission reduction should continue, in which case America is on track, and may continue with more specific emission reduction efforts for the years 2030 aqnd 2050 that also bring in agriculture, cement, steel and other industry whose businesses hitherto did not need disruption. Cost to businesses - and the consumers - is kept to a minimum, by equity and long term loan finance, the latter can be fed/state guaranteed to keep down interest rates, with slow payback anyway giving little affected consumer electricity bills or car costs. No disruption of American business practice and planning, by emission trading. No volatile extra emission trading costs for a range of businesses, passed on to consumers. Understanding Cap and Trade + why it is bad for America, see http://ceolas.net/#cce5x Hey Robert,

Good blog name
“Mind Your Own Damn Business Politics”
- wish the house would actually mind the business of CO2, assuming it needs to be dealt with anyway.

You talk about the costs…

Well one thing that keeps getting ignored is the ENERGY EFFICIENCY
side of savings: Maybe it sounds too good to criticize.

BAN consumers from buying what they WANT and applaud the savings!
(Little savings in banning impopular products, and inefficient products need to be popular or noone would buy them, classic example Edison’s light bulb, bought 19 times out of 20 in the USA and therefore a banning priority with a big section 211 all to its own in the Waxman-Markey Bill!).

The fact is that efficiency regulation on a product sacrifices performance, construction, appearance and price features, and does not necessarily give the savings suggested anyway.

See
http://ceolas.net/#cc2x
onwards regarding efficiency regulation effect on buildings, lightbulbs, cars, dishwashers and other products.

As for Cap and Trade…..

Cap and Trade is an expensive roundabout way of achieving…not very much.

Whatever one’s attitude to greenhouse gas emissions, they be lowered

just by changes in electricity and transport (together responsible for 4/5 of emissions!).

Electricity and transport changes have their own advantages – regardless of also lowering CO2:

1. Local environmental benefit from less pollution of sulphur and all else that’s in the emissions, regardless of the less certain or immediate global benefit from CO2 reduction – and that is one reason why the focus on carbon trading is wrong, compared with the focus on reducing fuel combustion emissions.
2. Electricity supply alternatives which together with improved grid distribution gives better conmpetition and keeps down electricity bills for consumers.
3. Transport alternatives (using electricity, hydrogen and other energy sources), which also reduces the dependency on oil imports.

In 2020, from then available evidence, either
1. There is increasing consensus that global warming can’t be stopped anyway, and that further specific reduction attempts have no value: In that case little has been lost, since the described changes in electricity and transport industry carry their own benefit, or
2. Consensus remains that CO2 emission reduction should continue, in which case America is on track, and may continue with more specific emission reduction efforts for the years 2030 aqnd 2050 that also bring in agriculture, cement, steel and other industry whose businesses hitherto did not need disruption.

Cost to businesses – and the consumers – is kept to a minimum,
by equity and long term loan finance, the latter can be fed/state guaranteed to keep down interest rates, with slow payback anyway giving little affected consumer electricity bills or car costs.
No disruption of American business practice and planning, by emission trading.
No volatile extra emission trading costs for a range of businesses, passed on to consumers.

Understanding Cap and Trade + why it is bad for America, see
http://ceolas.net/#cce5x

]]> By: AntonioSosa http://mindyourowndamnbusinesspolitics.com/wordpress/2009/06/27/cap-and-trade-challenge-your-senators-to-read-the-bill/comment-page-1/#comment-593 AntonioSosa Sat, 27 Jun 2009 18:53:49 +0000 http://mindyourowndamnbusinesspolitics.com/wordpress/?p=862#comment-593 The bill is indeed historic as far as the outrageous lies, manipulation, intimidation and bribes used by Obama and his accomplices to force the House to pass Obama’s economy killing bill. Corruption and cohertion reached levels previously seen only in Marxist dictatorships like Cuba or Venezuela. Obama’s Cap and trade is another giant step towards Marxism — and the corruption, poverty, enslavement, destruction and despair that Marxism entails. Obama is working much faster than Hugo Chavez at destroying the economy and imposing Marxism. No wonder the Russians are gloating: From Pravda: “…the American descent into Marxism is happening with breath taking speed, against the back drop of a passive, hapless sheeple, excuse me dear reader, I meant people…” http://english.pravda.ru/opinion/columnists/107459-american_capitalism-0 We are NOT hapless sheeple! We must do whatever is necessary to defend ourselves and our children from the Marxist dictatorship that’s being set up in Washington. The bill is indeed historic as far as the outrageous lies, manipulation, intimidation and bribes used by Obama and his accomplices to force the House to pass Obama’s economy killing bill. Corruption and cohertion reached levels previously seen only in Marxist dictatorships like Cuba or Venezuela.

Obama’s Cap and trade is another giant step towards Marxism — and the corruption, poverty, enslavement, destruction and despair that Marxism entails.

Obama is working much faster than Hugo Chavez at destroying the economy and imposing Marxism. No wonder the Russians are gloating:

From Pravda: “…the American descent into Marxism is happening with breath taking speed, against the back drop of a passive, hapless sheeple, excuse me dear reader, I meant people…” http://english.pravda.ru/opinion/columnists/107459-american_capitalism-0

We are NOT hapless sheeple! We must do whatever is necessary to defend ourselves and our children from the Marxist dictatorship that’s being set up in Washington.

]]>